Re: DART vs. GWT

I believe you're right. A lot of people, myself included, are turned off by Java. (It's no coincidence that Java is one of the most despised languages in the world, along with PHP, Visual Basic, C++, and JavaScript, with Perl often mentioned, too.) Java is too "heavy" a language, and it is by no means a "fun" language. (I personally favour Go, Python, and Smalltalk.)

For both GWT and Dart project, Google should've focused on a much simpler and more elegant language. Google should not have tried to appeal to Java developers. Making Dart Java-like may well be the nail in the coffin.

I agree that JS is the 'assembler' language of the web. Given that, I am drawn to Amber Smalltalk...

On Friday, 21 November 2014 10:23:43 UTC-5, Ümit Seren wrote:

I guess it is largely related to the fact that it's Java and most people in web-development come from the Javascript side of things and for them Java is much more verbose than Javascript (this will change when GWT supports the Java 8 syntax). 

Dart has basically the same problem. People are asking why Dart hasn't yet replaced Javascript yet although as a language it combines the powerful features from different languages (Java, C#, smalltalk, etc).

Javascript is not going anywhere and is becomming more and more the new assembler language/intermediate (IL)/VM (whatever you want to call it) of the web. 

Even Javascript itself can nowadays be compiled down to a simpler form of Javascript (Traceur ES6 -> ES5).

  

A lot of high level languages have emerged that try to solve the pitfalls of Javascript (Dart, GWT, Typescript, Atscript). You can even compile C++ down to Javascript but none of them will replace Javascript.

I think future Javascript versions might evolve more towards the direction of Typescript/Atscript and solve some of the issues.  


On Thursday, November 20, 2014 9:38:32 PM UTC+1, Richard Eng wrote:

I've been trying to understand the reasons GWT has not become a widespread JS alternative. It has lost a great deal of mindshare; it's pretty much a niche market now. Dart appears to be Google's second crack at the whip (possibly learning from GWT's mistakes?).

There is very little discussion on the web about these reasons. Is it really because of Java's reputation for being complicated and difficult?

Or could the elephant in the room be issues surrounding compiling to JS? If so, this would be the same obstacle Dart faces.

So, why did GWT not take the world by storm?

On Wednesday, 22 August 2012 18:10:38 UTC-4, Joseph Lust wrote:

Frankly the only issue GWT has, which Dart likely does not, is that it requires intelligent Java developers. You know, that language that is all strict and requires you to really understand what you're doing. Generics, oh my!

Script kiddies don't much care for XML, unit testing frameworks, Aria, UiBinder, i18n, hyper optmized JS and the like. To them these are hoops. I would not expect frameworks that really are best in class at making RIA's to be the 'most popular' for this reason. And it's not just the kiddies. To others like seasoned JSP developers, many of the concepts are still new in GWT, and why would they want to change?

So I'd never expect GWT to become super popular or to surpass PHP/jQuery mashups. But I can say from experience that in the enterprise space, where these features are sought afters, it is continuing to gain popularity. We've got 70 GWT devs in my office alone.

Sincerely,

Joseph 

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